Startups Start Your Engines with Andrew Kahn, Yamaha Music Innovation Fund
- Eric Doades
- Aug 4
- 34 min read
Join the Music Tectonics team for the June Seismic Activity with special guest Andrew Kahn, Managing Partner of Yamaha Music Innovation Fund. Hear Andrews best practices for pitching him (or not) at a conference, and what he feels is the most important aspect of any pitch deck. Hint: It's not a great power point. We also hear queries specific to founders in attendance. Among them are questions about funding AI startups, is it possible to compete with Ticketmaster, and what about this innovative new musical instrument? Really great insight from the heart of the funding world.
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Episode Transcript
Machine transcribed
Dmitri: Music Tectonics is the event music tech startups should attend. The conference in person is a blast. It's on the beach. It's beautiful. So much business gets done there. Why should you be there and why should you be part of our swim with. Narwals Startup competition. A startup, founders tell me they plan their entire year there.
They literally take a notebook like this and they fill it up while they're at the conference, and then they tell me they've got a year's worth of plans and things they want to do. Collaborations, they come to meet with record labels, distributors, managers, partners, creators, they find collaborators to [00:01:00] do business with.
Plus, this last year we had over 25. Active investors as part of the conference. They spoke at the conference. They were judges in the competition. They did speed networking or they were just chilling on the beach by the pool, meeting with founders, testing out things, demoing things, and so forth. So you're gonna come to the conference anyway, at least you should.
by the way, if any of you are past attendees and you wanna put in the chat right now, why you come every year, we would love to see that. We love sharing the, the energy of the community here.
So if you're gonna attend the conference, you might as well apply to the Swimming with narwals Startup Competition at the end of the event today, we'll give you more information about it. Applicants get public recognition.
They get the Speed network with investors. Andrew, our guest today was part of the speed networking last year. Loved the energy, Last week, someone told me. they came to the conference, they ended up getting a speaking gig at a conference in Europe this summer because of being there.
Others have met investors that have transformed their path as music tech founders, startup founders. they found technical co-founders,
So [00:02:00] I'm just encouraging you now to fast forward your journey and your connection in a supportive community by applying for this, music tech startup pitch competition. And we'll tell you all about it. Right after our fireside chat. All right, you with me? I love to see the chat.
I'm so happy to see you guys all here. Alright, so I want to introduce our guest today. Andrew Kahn is managing partner of the newly launched Yamaha Music Innovation Fund, an early stage consumer fund backed by Yamaha Corporation, that's focused on technology changing how culture gets created and consumed.
Prior to Yamaha, Andrew Led Crush Ventures, a venture firm founded by leading music talent management firm, Crush Music, who manages generational talent like Miley Cyrus, Green Day Lourde, and Fallout Boy. Andrew was on the founding team of Greenfly, a media SaaS business that provides critical infrastructure for how rights cleared content moves in closed influencer networks, and served as a business development executive at Live Nation, where he pioneered Ticketmaster's distributed commerce [00:03:00] platform.
Andrew, welcome to Music, tectonic. Seismic Activity.
Andrew: Thanks, Dmitri. Happy to be here.
Dmitri: Thanks for being here. Let's go ahead and dive in. I've got questions for you. We'll have a q and A at the end,
Andrew, how would you describe the state of investment in music, tech and entertainment and media tech right now?
Andrew: Oh, the state. okay. what matters most are a lot of really smart people, are excited about building solutions to problems that they perceive in the market. So I think founder enthusiasm is, at an all time high. Obviously we have this wave of technical innovation, that,will change the way we work and create and operate.
so founder enthusiasm. Technological innovation with ai, and, a lot of thorny and sticky problems across kinda the media, music, entertainment, landscape,makes for exciting times. I think, there are some big key themes happening with the, convergence, convergence of music and [00:04:00] media, the professionalization of the creator class.
Like all these things are lending, added momentum, and putting wind at the backs of founders from the investment side and investment perspective. like I generally feel our job is to react to, what comes to us. I wouldn't call myself a prognosticator. I don't know where the future's gonna go.
I think. I'm excited. I think that's all I can say is from my perspective, I'm excited 'cause there are so many smart people starting, so many interesting companies. Obviously we can't invest in all of them. that's where I have to go to work. But, so generally it's very exciting times.
there are bigger macro trends happening in venture capital that, are worth probably talking about.
Dmitri: Yeah, totally.
Andrew: you know, on the one hand you've got the consolidation of the big money, into the hands of the few. So, you know, there was an explosion of venture funds [00:05:00] really in the kind of zero interest rate area.
So a lot of available money flowed from LPs into venture funds that are generally not raising new funds either because they're over it or they didn't perform, or the just really hard. And so a lot of that money is now, whatever's left, is concentrating into the, the big name funds. So that's, that's one thing that is a bit of a headwind for startups.
other thing that's happening is a lot of the money is pouring into known entities because people are risk averse. So you have all this money continue to pour into a company like OpenAI, which may be an incredible investment, but like, what's the new round at 350 billion? like a lot of that money is pouring into safer spaces.
So I think the money available for startups got a lot of, in startup enthusiasms, you have a lot of rush with new technology, people coming into the market to solve problems. Easier to build, but less money available. particularly, at the early stages when, founders need it most. I don't know if that's a [00:06:00] helpful overview, but like, there's some macro trends, micro trends within, kind of music media landscape, mixed all that with a lot of founder enthusiasm.
You, you'll have a lot of companies that, find themselves banging their head against the wall, I think to raise venture capital.
Dmitri: Yeah, so it's, it's highly competitive. The supply of investment dollars is not, is not flowing as much as it had in other moments of time. But here you are with your new fund, which we'll talk in, talk about a little bit later about what your strategy is and how that fits in with, within the, um, within the space that is getting investment in the music and entertainment media tech space, what are the verticals that are attracting the most investor attention?
what are the things that are grabbing interest there that you can tell? is it ai? Is it rights management? Is it fan monetization? Is it marketing tools? Is it music education? what do you think is you kind of painted the big picture, right? But like within this space, what is the hot stuff?
Andrew: I would, I would flip that around entirely and say it is all about the founder and the founding team and [00:07:00] their ability to paint a picture that they are solving an intractable problem. That ultimately leads to a very big outcome. So I, for one, don't find music rights and royalty solutions particularly compelling.
I do have a SaaS background, but like I think in this industry you have to align so many stakeholders and so many gatekeepers that it's really hard to build an effective business there, but presented by the right person with the right go to market and experience, and all of a sudden that looks very different to me.
so I would say it's less about the things that I'm paying attention to and more about the person who, and their unique credibility in solving a problem that they perceive is what's interesting to me. So that's what I look for. and particularly from a Yamaha perspective,Whose goal is to play a bigger role in the lives of creative people. Like a lot of what I, you know, it's like the bottom up. So not generally top down, not [00:08:00] artist, big artist first, but like bottom up solutions for, I don't know, like increasing accessibility to your So creator tools, distribution, monetization, all those things.
But really coming from founders who could build a groundswell around those kinds of tools, not people who go to the top and try to press down. I think that's a much actually harder path where you don't get product led growth. And that's obviously what we wanna see from an investor perspective or companies that come to us and are acquiring customers very cheaply.
I know I'm not answering your question directly but it's not vertical. Like Sure. Like you could build a great gen AI tool. You could build an incredible royalty tool. You can build distribution, learning all those things. We wanna see all of them. But ultimately, like it starts with the person who's telling you the story about why they're doing it, how they're doing it, and [00:09:00] how they're gonna do it, better than anybody else who's ever done it.
And that's what you're, that's what I invested.
Dmitri: I love that. I mean, I think that's helpful to it. It's actually, in some ways it can be hopeful because people are like trying to pick the right lane, but in reality, it's not about a right lane. It's not about jumping on the trend or the bandwagon of what's happening. It's more about, I mean, you said you actually did say some things that.
We could flesh out a little bit, that would get us into some specific areas. An intractable problem was one thing you mentioned, which I think is something that is a constant tension between startup founders who have an idea and investors who are deciding how to allocate their investment to, for the best return.
because how you define the problem is a lot of times it's in the founder's head, right? And they have to get it out of the, their head, make a convincing case about it. So in some ways, that probably does eliminate some of the kind of micro verticals within the music space in itself because there's so many solutions that are looking for a problem.
I hear investors say that all the time. like we don't, we're not looking for, solutions that are looking for a problem. [00:10:00] We're looking for solutions that address a problem that is known. And you said intractable, which is, you know, is a even stronger way of stating it. But you also said you're more interested in kind of ground up access tools in a sense.
So I think that does also eliminate some verticals, It's an emphasis on either creation or distribution or monetization of creative pursuits. and it's not like you're trying to build something at the top of the market. You know, you're not looking to invest in something that's we are going to be the next major record label.
No, we're gonna be the next thing that make record labels question whether they're doing the right thing, maybe. But it really starts at the bottom and goes up. am I getting that right?
Andrew: I think that's right and I would say that's probably true across any investment category is especially now is build, like the idea of product led growth means that your users, your customers become your biggest fans who do the advocating for you and [00:11:00] grow your user base.
And then enterprise sales come later. once you see a bunch of URLs registered, as users for your product, and then you say, wow, we've got 50 people from make up a company Google using this. let's go sell them an enterprise deal. They've got 30 million or 30,000 employees. we can sell this at an enterprise as opposed to top down.
I would also say, starting with the rights holders first, obviously creates like a tremendous barrier for any investor to believe a story having been around the block a little bit. these aren't, these are organizations with power who don't want to see their power eroded and so they're very careful with who they partner with and how they partner and what the economics of those things are.
And they can afford to take their time and I would if I were in their shoes too. Just 'cause, you know, a record label says they're interested in this solution, which I hear a lot like, oh, I'm not gonna say, I'm just saying Sony to say Sony, I love the people at [00:12:00] Sony. Sony told us they're interested or they're gonna send a term sheet.
And I'm like, that is not enough validation. I would much rather see wow, you've got 30,000 users that signed up and they all came organically through a referral network of like this viral loop. Like those things get me really excited when I talk to startups.
Dmitri: In a sense, you're almost saying if you're, if you're thinking the enterprise way to go, is the, is gonna be a primary channel for distribution of your, your platform or your company or whatever, your technology. You're almost saying look for the young, experienced operator within the company who's actually doing stuff to adopt your platform and use that as a reason to get execs at the company.
Interested. Get them to sort of make it critical that they use your tech rather than pitching at the top to try to go through the front door.
Andrew: In the beginning, right? Like it's how you have to start. any sales motion starts that way. You find your internal advocate. But if you make it available for them to use at a low cost, [00:13:00] 50 bucks a month, a hundred bucks a month, they may just pay for that themselves. that could ultimately lead to an enterprise conversation.
But I think when you, you know, go to the enterprises first, the gatekeepers with entrenched processes, unless you're solving again, an intractable problem that is so intractable and usually marked by, we do this with email, Dropbox spreadsheets, it's a huge thing. And then when you mess with their money, like you better have something real
That's it is like, well then when you mess with like, the core of their business, which is like how they get paid and how money moves. yeah. Like you, you gotta have a real solid answer. And for, and really customers like, that's what I wanna see is okay, yeah, that's a, a big intractable problem, but like, can you sell it?
And if you can,that kinda changes the dynamic of our conversation, I think.
Dmitri: Cool. Alright. Well you started off by saying, I'm not gonna answer your question and I kind of made you answer it a little bit. Not necessarily by particular verticals, but like how to think about those spaces. [00:14:00] But you did say that founders, you know, it's really about the founder you're investing in the founder, which we, you know, I've heard a lot from investors as well.
I'm not shocked by it, but I am curious, since we have you and we have so many founders on the Zoom today, what are you looking for from the founder, either during or after the pitch? Maybe it's questions you ask, but ultimately what is it that you're trying to figure out and how are you figuring it out?
Andrew: I'm not saying I'm any good at it. So let's like preface all this with, takes five to seven years, maybe 10 years to know if you're good at it. But yeah, I mean like it's the what, it's the why. It's the unfair go to market. it's honesty about why your company could fail. I mean, those are like the general questions I start off with in any pitch.
the thing I'm trying to get to is like founder market fit, because early stage, you again, it's a bet on a person or a, a small team. And so it's believing that coming to believe that this team has some unique insight, the [00:15:00] ability to build, and execute. And that's what I'm trying to solve for at the earlier stages.
Is founder market fit? are you, like you said, are you building this because you feel this problem personally, or are you building this because like you, you see there's an opportunity to make money and you're, not that there's anything wrong with that, maybe that's fine. Maybe that company wins, but for the 20 to 25 investments we're gonna make out of this fund, four to five a year.
We really wanna feel really good about the team that we're backing and that,we can't throw around money like big firms. So I gotta believe that this team can't live without solving this problem. and then that they can build, I'm not investing pre-product, unless there's some maybe a third, second, third time founder who's had success.
got a product, you could show it to us. It worked. And you have early customer traction. So there are preceded investors. I wouldn't put us in that bucket. with a [00:16:00] million dollar first check, not that we wouldn't play there, but really, like for me at this point in the market where things are, is I wanna see some traction.
I wanna see that you can build a community of really enthusiastic users. Those are the things that I look for in every call. And. That's not to say that there aren't, like you should be able to raise money early on if you're, you've got a compelling pitch just for us. We, I need to see those things to get real comfortable, then taking this through committee and advocating for it, right?
Because ultimately we still have to sell this into our board who, we vote to make decisions. This isn't a one man operation.
Dmitri: Hey, we got a question in the chat from, Parker. Busick from Soloist who is curious to, to find out what does early customer traction look like? I think the emphasis is on early, right?
Andrew: I don't know, like traction in market. The key things are like, it's not a number. It's like what's the number? Like I've seen companies with [00:17:00] 700,000 users, 5,000 paying, like, so people are using it, but they're not really paying. what is, there's all these deltas that we then try to dive into and understand why the difference, what does that mean?
Can you make up the gap? some have a believable story to go from 5,000 to a hundred thousand of those people paying, like we want to dive in under, so it's not an aggregate number. To me. It's like you see an upward trajectory that's more than linear. It's compounding because people are enthusiastic about the product.
It's really good retention all around, but particularly on people who are paying for it. some kind of viral, hate that, like a douchy investor term viral coefficient. Look it up if you don't know what it means. But, like those are the things that I think we try to, again, we're just taking data points.
Those would be the three that I would use for a, answering that question. What, what does early user traction mean? all those things and then we still have to believe that this market is massive and we can get, it could return our fund. that is [00:18:00] ultimately the question we have to, we do the math.
It's okay, this could get big enough with our million dollar check and our, five to 10% ownership that with some dilution or further rounds and investing our Retta that we could return the fund with this. So for founders, that's the math we're doing on our side.
Dmitri: Got it. Okay. One follow up to that. I've got a couple other things I wanna ask you, but how do you typically evaluate early stage startups that might not have much traction yet?
how do you even have conversations with, maybe they do have a great product, maybe you can, you can project out, you've been in the music industry long enough to know sort of like, oh, they're actually solving a problem. It's a big addressable market, but they haven't started yet. They're like, okay, now we want, now we wanna launch.
We wanna, we want somebody like Yamaha to support us in this launch. How do you evaluate no traction startups?
Andrew: I'm an interloper, you know, more than I do. so I'll just caveat everything with that. Like, again, I'm much more of a, like, let's get down to the facts of who's building it, what they're building. Do they know how to get to market? Do they have viral, like real [00:19:00] traction. For, super early stage, when I've made those bets, it's all about the founder.
It's about the founder and the product. if you don't have customers, don't buy it. you should be able to build a community. there shouldn't be a product that we're seeing pre-seed that doesn't have a community, at least a tragedy, but really, like you've built some kind of community online somewhere.
Like you've done that work. Because I, I think you've probably heard this, but, and so I'm just repeating what way smarter people have said, but like, you know, first town, first time founders obsessed over products, second time founders obsess over distribution. You know, it's like the tree falling in the forest.
you gotta think about both. And when you come to, us, like an investor in the pre-seed, if you haven't thought about your go to market, that's a big problem. You should to get that money, come to a pre-seed investor with a great founder story, a believable, big market, demonstrable, product, and then traction [00:20:00] on some level, with a community, at least a plan to do it, but like I'm talking a Discord server or, telegram channel, like something that, or big email list that you've built because you partner with an influencer or something like that, that would allow an investor.
Again, we're telling a story about you to the people we have to defend our decisions to, and so help us tell that story really well. that's how I would, as a founder, I would think about it like that, like you're selling to me and I'm then selling this to a different group of people who I need bought in and excited about it.
Dmitri: Okay. questions are starting to come in, which is awesome. before we get to the audience questions, what can you tell us about Yamaha's investment strategy, especially if there's anything that might surprise founders, maybe lay it out for us. We haven't even talked really about any of this.
what are you trying to do here?
Andrew: look, I think that this is my opportunity to sell founders on Yamaha, I think everybody in the world knows who Yamaha is. this is a generations old com company. a hundred year old company that has played a [00:21:00] critical role in the lives of creative people.
I think I mentioned in the beginning, but Yamaha's motives here with this fund are to expand the role it plays in the lives of creative people. One thing that we bring, at the early stage, like what do you want in an investor? You can get money anywhere, but What do you need help with as a founder?
you need technical help. You need, consult, you know, help with how you run your business. Things that you are plugging your gaps. Like where I think we come in and where we can be extremely helpful is, there are many kind of points where we can do that, but like distribution. So Yamaha has this kinda treasure trove of assets and a dedicated platform team that works with our fund to help leverage all that Yamaha brings to bear 3000 official artists.
you can look 'em, just from, I'm not saying that you're gonna get Elton John and Alicia Keys, but I'm saying they're the official artists, 10 million customers, global distribution and relationships. one, like a degree removed from every door that you need opened. [00:22:00] 400,000 kids around the world coming through Yamaha's music schools.
never nevermind that Yama has, That Just makes musical instruments and audio equipment, but like tons of software. So there are integration, opportunities galore. And so these are all the things that we wanna bring to bear for the startups that we invest in. And Summit will be opening a door and others it will be a, an integration that exposes them to, a million new customers.
that's what we are trying to do that's different in the market. So that's my pitch on Yamaha. but we're also still trying to win real big, there's obviously strategic goals with any, single LP backed fund. Like we have goals that we're trying to accomplish for Yamaha, but we also have financial goals and we are trying to win big by betting on founders with big ideas that will have huge outcomes and change industries.
Dmitri: Got it. So when Steve Stewart in our chat asks, does Yamaha consider itself more as a VC or a strategic, how do you, what's the direct answer to that?
Andrew: Yeah. Both strategic vc, we're a venture capital fund. Yes, there is [00:23:00] a kind of strategic lens that we will look at everything through. The goalposts aren't, it's not a generalist fund. but also, yes, we are uniquely strategic, I think in terms of capital that you could take as a founder.
Dmitri: and we obviously set this up as a music industry music tech conversation. But you've told me to think bigger, to think wider than just music, which is unexpected to me because it's called Yamaha Music Innovation Fund. Can you say a little bit more about how wide you go with that thought?
Andrew: This is not a music innovation fund. This is a Yamaha Music Innovation Fund. So the aperture is why the aperture is the big themes are anybody with a passion for ip and as measured by skill from professional creator to opposable thumbs like who wants to engage with IP more than like just swiping on social media.
[00:24:00] that's the kind of spectrum, if you will, of like where we're looking and everybody at from, passive fan who's focused on consumption to active fans who are, focused on. More active participation and co-creation to, the future of UGC creation, whatever that means, to pro Sumer, to pro.
Like we're investing all along that spectrum. And it's not just in music, it's because music and media have converged. You don't have one without the other. Like it's the whole creator space.
Dmitri: Cool. I have one last question, then we'll go to the audience for additional questions. We're part of the Music Tectonics conference. We're encouraging people to come build community. you've met people at Music Tectonics yourself, I'm sure. thanks for participating, Andrew, it's always been great to have you there.
What should startups have ready when they attend a conference like Music Tectonics, where they'll meet investors and other potential partners?
Andrew: I gotta say. don't come up with a pitch, just be human. I've had so many times I'm like, I don't know where this [00:25:00] investor be. I was on the other side, on a founding team of a startup. Like I know the urgency. To go sell and pitch. And I would just say if you happen into a conversation with somebody who says, oh no, I'm an investor for, so, and it's like, oh, that's super interesting.
What do you focus on? tell me more about that. talk to them like a human. Don't come up and share a pitch. It's always like, make an impression that you are somebody that they would like to be in business with and then follow up after, right? Nobody wants to get pitched on the spot. Everyone's gonna be nice to your face.
again, keep in mind our goal is a thousand investments reviewed a year to make four to five investments. So, you know, it's a low batting average against, uh, decks received. So keep that in mind that like the let probability is low. So get to know somebody's a human. Try to win them over that way first and then follow up politely, if you're not getting reception, they could be really busy.
hounding doesn't work, like none [00:26:00] of that. But I wouldn't come up with a deck, I wouldn't come up with a pitch. I wouldn't offer a demo unless somebody expresses interest. It's always like, let's follow up after. Is that cool? Yes, absolutely. Connect on LinkedIn or get their email. That's all I would from a investor.
That's all I could recommend at a conference when want to talk to investors.
Dmitri: Just a quick follow up on that. Are you saying if somebody comes up with a slick pitch, it feels like they're just throwing it out everywhere and they don't really, they're not looking to really understand your goals or connect. Is that why you're saying that?
Andrew: I don't know. I just don't like being pitched to like, I, who wants to be sold? I like it is a sale. I would rather get to know somebody on a human level first. these are people you're gonna be in business with for a long time through good and bad. Most don't work out. So you wanna make sure that like it's a person you.
if you can sell me, like if you walk up and cold pitch me and I didn't say pitch me, I don't know. Are you gonna be able to sell to somebody else? Like is is an artist gonna buy in this or a creator or an enterprise? I don't know. I, I think it's a lot of like, be [00:27:00] genuine, be honest.
And it's not, the form to pitch is when you meet somebody speed pitch. Yes, totally. Or if you're on stage. Absolutely. But if it's like walking around a conference, you see somebody with an investor badge or you recognize that, it's like, Hey, I recognize you. what's up? What are you doing here? Are you having fun?
You seeing anything? those are the things I would ask. and that's what I would wanna be, how I would wanna be approached. At least. I don't know if that's answering your question. It's more like, be a human, don't pitch, on the spot. Maybe that works for some people. I don't know. Maybe some investors are like, okay, go. It's not how I would do it.
Dmitri: Yeah. Cool. Okay, cool.
maybe I will to surprise everybody. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. They're gonna come up to you at Music Tectonics, and they're gonna, they're gonna be like, Hey, are you into such and such? Hey, have you heard this new band? And you're gonna be like, where's your pitch? Give me your deck. Are you ready to demo?
Andrew: right. And I would also say I am one set of eyes every investor, one set of eyes who does not know and will mostly be wrong. So keep in mind when, if somebody doesn't want to hear the pitch or says no, that [00:28:00] doesn't mean that your idea is not right or you won't win. they're in a bad mood, sometimes they just don't see the vision, whatever, like maybe they invest in the next round.
So just keep all that in mind, like you're still dealing with people on the other side who get slammed all day with more information and you know.
Dmitri: Yeah. Cool. We now have some hands raised. Um, love this. Let's go through these questions quickly 'cause I have a hunch there's gonna be a lot of people. Toby, I'm gonna go Toby and then, and then in the order that they were raised, just 'cause Toby had his hand up earlier. tell us your name, your company, just one little line about your company or what you're up to.
And then your question please. Toby, you're up.
Guests: Hi, my name is Toby. I'm the founder of T-Shirt. I'm building an AI co-producer for creators. the question I had might be a little bit of a curve ball was, it makes sense why Yamaha is interested in. Investing in the music or the IP space. I was curious to learn a bit, a little bit about why you, Andrew, are interested in this space.
I'll give you, there's larger markets to kind of address. You could be selling [00:29:00] AI to like dentists and all those sorts of stuff. So why? Why aren't you doing that? Why are you doing music or ip? As you said earlier,
Andrew: do I have to answer all the questions? Uh.
Guests: oh one question.
Andrew: like people take different paths. mine has always been around media and entertainment, so I've just spent time in this space. It wasn't like I was born and I'm like, I'm gonna do that. But,the opportunities present themselves in your lives and you go down different paths and it's just something I've been exposed to and around.
And the opportunity came with Yamaha and it was super exciting, honestly, to be with like a generational brand and to lead something like this, where I thought, again, knowing the platform and what other venture firms bring to the table, that I thought this was just a unique once in a long time opportunity.
I dunno if that answers the question or not.
Dmitri: you were at Crush Music before that.
Andrew: Yeah, that was awesome too. That was a great opportunity. I had left a startup and [00:30:00] threw somebody who had invested in our, my seed around, like introduced me to that opportunity. I didn't, it, it just, you know, opportunities come about and, you evaluate them and make decisions. So why am you know, I think there's, look, this is a Toby, to answer your question like I am, I, again, I said I'm not an expert.
Like I'm, I don't know the future, but it's a space I've just spent a lot of time in. And so when I saw the platform with Yamaha, knowing that I've been investing in this space for six years, I thought the combination of those things could make this be a really powerful firm. That's honestly what I thought.
Dmitri: Awesome.
thanks Toby. John Gearty, please introduce yourself, your company, and your question.
Guests: Hi, Andrew, John Garrity from Holstead Studios. Nice to meet you. I worked on the Apple Vision Pro among other things at Apple for quite a while, and so, uh, my company does immersive music content for Vision Pro and Meta Quest and others. It's AI powered stuff. And I'm curious, you haven't really talked about AI much, but it's clearly the hot topic for VC and the, hot topic in the capital markets these days.
And I'm curious, um, [00:31:00] for music, it, it represents, both potentially threats and opportunities. I'm just curious how Yamaha sees ai, whether more as a threat or more as an opportunity, or if there's a take on it or if there's a bent for this particular round you're investing,what's, what are your thoughts on ai.
Andrew: Well, I can't speak for how Yamaha sees it, although they're very technically capable and are building their own solutions, for their own products. Yamaha side, I can't speak for them, but for the, from a fund perspective, like Yeah, absolutely. What a exciting space to be investing in. I do think it's gonna usher in a whole new.
Class of creative people not that this is certainly believe in like the careers of professional artists, but like technology has always been rough to adopt. And there've always been people like, no man, the kids, they don't work as hard as they, But then eventually everybody catches up and it's like, how could I live my life without this?
I think we're in, this, it'll be that kind of moment. So like, you know, [00:32:00] creative industries wise, there's, yeah, I think people are afraid, but like the first ones to adopt it are gonna win and then everyone will catch up and, start using Photoshop, right? that didn't exist and then it did.
And now there's no, that is a career as being an expert in that. And I think, you know, it'd be the same with these tools.
Guests: same to me. Yep. Game changer for sure. Cool. Thanks.
Dmitri: Thanks John Parker, you're up. Please introduce yourself and ask your question.
Guests: Hello. yeah, Parker Busick working on a multiplayer loop pedal. I got a pitch at Tectonics last year, so I'll just make a quick aside. Like if you're a music tech founder in here and you're not applying for that, I would just be super curious why you would not do that. 'cause it was a super cool opportunity to get some time with like people like Andrew and Richie.
my question. And if this is like a dumb question or whatever, we will just move on to the next one. I know there's a line, but, Andrew, I want to talk about that whole human, balancing being a human versus being an urgent pragmatist. next Wednesday I get to go to the house of the founder of Sweetwater, [00:33:00] Chuck Rack.
And just because I found out he was playing a local show in my hometown, I went and shot my shot, got to talk to him, and now I get to go to his house. I'm trying to figure out how I should use this time 'cause he's a super important dude, like a billionaire or whatever. I've never gotten a chance to talk to somebody like this, so I wanna be like a human and I don't wanna, but at the same time, I don't wanna waste his time and, trying to figure out in this first conversation with him, should I just be trying to tell him my story, tell him about myself and learn about him, and just have a nice human conversation that might lead to more conversations Or should I talk about some of my urgent, pragmatic,business Asks or desires or advice that I'm seeking? A big, big asterisk around that whole advice question. You know, I'm just curious how I should approach a conversation like this with somebody who's pretty cool.
Andrew: I would just do what you just did. Hey, look man, I'm super excited to be here. so I wanna show you what I built, but like. What? What, how would you like to take it? You [00:34:00] can I tell you my story? Can I, I don't like, yeah, I mean, that's
Guests: hmm, hmm hmm.
Andrew: You're, you're like so good at that.
it comes through here, it came through last year. Like, just be charming, but I'd love, I wanna show it to you. and I don't wanna waste your time, so you tell me how I can, you know, you're guy, how can I make the best use of their, of your time?
Guests: I like that. Just kind of put it in his court a little bit.
Andrew: Yeah.
Guests: Cool. Thank you.
Dmitri: how, how hard, how hard would it be to just show him to demo it?
Guests: Super easy. Super easy.
Dmitri: I mean, make sure that's an option on the table, I think. if you can show up and do something cool musical, the dude started with a Volkswagen Mini
Guests: Yes.
Dmitri: going to like produce people's shows or engineer record the shows and then having a big business, I think in the church world, like I think that's where things really exploded there as well.
that's just an idea. not, I mean,
Guests: Oh, no. Yeah, I've got a billion thoughts in my head, but,
Andrew: definitely bring the product to demo I, I think just more tell me how you want me to play it.
Guests: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Nice. I have some ideas. Thank[00:35:00]
Dmitri: Cool. Thanks Parker. Oliver, you're up. Please introduce yourself and ask your question.
Guests: Hi. Hi, Andrew. Hi, Dimitri. I'm, I'm Oliver. We're building Cassa, a community centered ticketing and discovery platform designed for music collectives and independent organizers. Andrew, you mentioned that you were previously working at Ticketmaster. I just wanted to get your view on Ticketmaster grip on the global music, ticketing market, and if you think it's sustainable moving forward.
I know we've seen apps like Party Fall and other different sort of, apps come along for music marketing and ticketing, and they're more focused around independent and niche organizers. Just wanted to get your view on that, and if you think Ticket Masters Grip is sustainable moving forward.
Andrew: Oh man. You can get me in trouble for answering this question.
Dmitri: Don't get in trouble on my, on my Zoom. Okay.
Andrew: Okay. I can't get in trouble here. I didn't even think about particle as a solution for this, but that should tell you how well Particle's doing, if they're in your view as somebody who's building the space, view them as somebody who's making [00:36:00] significant enough traction in the event organizing DIY space that, you would consider them a threat to Ticket Master.
So, like my answer is build from the bottom up. every market in the world is different. Like you as a ticketer and you sound like you have a accent. You're probably from the uk. you have a shot in that market because it's an allocation based market. But like, I get millions of ticketing pitches in the US and it's just a way more, it's a way more difficult dynamic to compete here.
if you look at somebody like a SeatGeek who's really the one that's broken through. Become a firm semi formidable competitor. I think I first met them in like 2012. they've been on a 13, 14 year, 15 year journey now almost. And they've, you gotta give away a lot of equity to rights holders. that's how you compete here. So I would advocate for bottom up, approach in the ticketing, like, like a particle. There's, there are a bunch of people focused in that space. I think that's a great, I think it's kinda the only place to start, but I can't tell you what's gonna happen with Ticketmaster.
[00:37:00] I don't know, but they have a really good business.
Dmitri: Great, thanks for the question. We've got about five minutes and about. Seven. Hands up, So it's time for a speed round. You ready for this Andrew? We're gonna go fast guys. Bill, please introduce yourself and ask a question.
Guests: Hey guys, I'll try to go fast. Trevor and I co-founders here of Dog Paw. We have this new musical instrument, that we're looking to sell, and we were excited based on the thesis that we saw online for Yamaha, that there was a category for like next gen instruments and hardware. But I haven't really heard that, brought up today.
I know that's like probably the hardest for traditional VCs to invest in. That's kind of why you're excited about the Yamaha Fund specifically. we are curious if that's still on the table for this fund and if that has been deemphasized, or if there's other kind strategic considerations going into those types of investments.
Thanks.
Andrew: Not really a focus for the fund, for obvious reasons. I think if there was something that had, that was really unique and was getting like earnest groundswell of traction, then it's, I'm sure it's something we'd take a look at.
Dmitri: Thanks for the question, bill. Kylie, you're up.
Guests: [00:38:00] what's up? I'm Kylie Camon, artist manager turned,the founder I suppose. Uh, so I'm in the process of building something called the Rabbit Hole. rabbit Hole is a social media management system, and analytics platform built specifically for artists and their teams.
my question is, what do you suggest, people do when they're in the very early stages where you think that maybe VCs are, wouldn't be willing to look at them because, they're still in the progress of building out that MVP, but they still need, some funding nonetheless.
Andrew: Friends and family try to get, you know, if you,
Guests: you wouldn't say that.
Andrew: yeah. Friends and family, if you are, I mean, they're accelerators you can apply to, and then, if you've been in the industry, try to align some strategic investors who would use the software in the beginning. Those are the things that I think that's where I would start.
Dmitri: I know that's hard, Kylie. Sometimes you're like friends and family, they already did contribute or they don't have any money or whatever. Just means extend your friends and
Guests: Friends and family, I'd rather jump off a cliff than ask anybody for money ever again.
Andrew: Yeah. Then, [00:39:00] then, then I will then, and I'll tell you, then you're gonna have a real hard time raising money because you're always asking,
Guests: I know these people. Doesn't matter. Keep going.
Dmitri: we will. We'll grow out your friends and family. That's it. We'll find more friends and more family. All right. Thanks for asking, Kylie. Alex, you're up
Guests: Alex, trip Lab in California, we work on contextual, intelligent content. Been, six Long years in pre-seed now because it's so complex. I read,one of your partners in an interview that he's also interested in co-development, rather than just investing.
Can you talk a little bit about that?
Andrew: I think it would have to be a very unique use case for us to also join as a founder, but generally not gonna be the focus of the fund. But we do partner also separate from the Fund with emerging startups to help them leverage the Yamaha ecosystem. there's a whole other side of this outside the fund within the innovation team that does focus on [00:40:00] partnership opportunities with startups.
Dmitri: Julian, real quick, what's your question, please?
Guests: hey, Andrew.
Andrew: Hey bud.
about three years ago. How? Yeah. how are your kids? I think when we chatted they were just getting born, right? yeah. A amazing to see the transition from crush, right? does not open sesame. I see sync
Guests: Oh,no. It, that's the product. So the product sync stage, same thing. So since we spoke, I think we've raised like four rounds of funding, but I wanted to get your thoughts on creator tools because that's where, what sync stage is in and specifically, if we think about roadblocks, and actually they're probably one of the most successful creator tools companies, essentially creating, create tools for seven year olds.
I wanted to get your thoughts on where Yamaha's position on that, because we can create CRE tools, but are we actually trying to create creator tools for seven year olds? So if the thesis is increase in end number of creators, is it about simplicity and ease of use versus more creative tools?
Andrew: Good question. I don't know. Both. [00:41:00] Yes. like there's again,the skills and skills is generally a reflection of age and experience. sure, why wouldn't we want to invest in the next roadblocks, but also. semi-pro like aspiring professionals or UGC creators to prosumer to pro. They need different tools.
'cause they're older and have more capacity. So I think we would invest all along that. we're invested. I'm in, in my last fi invested in a DAW that is played with a video game controller. yes, the bet is kids have a game control in their hands since the time they're six years old.
Why wouldn't that be an instrument? That's a skill, right? To be great with that, to have great opposable thumbs, that's just like to play the guitar, you have to have good dexterity or the piano like people are professionals playing using controllers. Why wouldn't you be with technology? Why couldn't you be a great musician or creator using a video game controller?
So to answer your question, yes to all.
Dmitri: Awesome. Thanks for that, Julian. Thanks Andrew.
Guests: James O'Brien, you're
[00:42:00] Hello. I'm a co-founder of Sound Ethics. We work with universities on research projects and develop ip, that solves challenges for the music industry in the AI era. And then my question is about whether you support any accelerator programs or it sounded like there was a hint of like more about the innovation lab.
Andrew: we are not part of any accelerators. I think that's one answer Two, what was the second part?
Guests: whether you have like an innovation lab or you know. Basically participate in like r and d in that way.
Andrew: Oh, an innovation lab to participate in RD. Yes. There's a huge RD team at Yamaha. if you think there's a reason to have a conversation with 'em, happy to send the information along.
Guests: Awesome. Thank you.
Dmitri: Yeah, Andrew, I'd heard that within your kind of wing of Yamaha, there's also biz dev folks who are interested in those kind of introductions as well.
Andrew Carlins, real quick, what's your question?
Guests: Hi, I'm Andrew Carlins. I'm a CEO and co-founder of Song Script. we're a team of, uh, of, Stanford folks who have trained [00:43:00] proprietary AI models that automate audio committee and audio to sheet music transcription. I'm wondering one, if this is something we're also revenue generating already, and we're looking for strategics, I'm wondering one, if this is something that fits well within yours or if you could advise other strategics to reach out to.
And two, what your view on is, say like our tool augments the music process. It's using AI versus something like Suno and nio, which may replace the creatives. And what your view as a music investor is about the future of AI in music. Is it more to augment the existing processes, or is AI the next creator?
Andrew: I don't know. Both maybe, I hope it's not AI as the creator, but I. as far as I can tell, they still require a text-based prompt. no, that sounds interesting, man. right down the road from you today, and tomorrow, but, uh, yeah, I, some of these things get a little bit on the nose, like Yamaha, and their goals with the sheet music.
but that's, certainly a interesting area. the question [00:44:00] I have personally is can that be a massive company? Would be the question I'd ask of your business if you pitched me. But, besides that,do I believe that AI should augment, I would hope it would augment. I mean, it's always been, it's like people are like, oh my God, name, the software is gonna replace humans.
And like it does, right? we know that. I'm actually gonna repeat what everybody else has said, like. Yes. Like people used to work in the fields and then they moved to factories, and then, people learn new skills and you retooled and why wouldn't that be any different? It feels uncomfortable, but it doesn't mean that, we're all gonna be replaced.
I think we'll just be augmented, hopefully you tell me, man, you're your team of Stanford. Uh, you're the smartest guy in the room. What do you think?
Guests: I know there are other folks, but, uh, could we, could I don't wanna take up too much space. We could talk another time, Andrew.
Andrew: No, this is a, this is the Andrew Zoom, so you're part of it, man.
Guests: Thank you.
Dmitri: Awesome. Thanks for that, Andrew and Andrew. Appreciate that. And Andrew Kahn, thank you so much for making yourself available. [00:45:00] this has been amazing In the chat, I've seen people are like, this is the first time I've ever heard this kind of information and so forth. You shared so much. Really appreciate it.
A round of applause for Andrew Kahn in the chat here and come out to Music Tectonics to meet him in person as well. Shaylee, why don't you take us out. You've got a couple of important things you need to announce.
Shayli: Before everyone logs off, be before, be sure to register for all of our next online events coming up. If you have any PR or marketing needs, be sure to reach out to Jade at rock paper.
Scissors do biz. As I mentioned, we launched a PR club that's really great for a lot of startups, so definitely reach out to him if you're interested in getting in. In the Music Tectonics conference, I would love to have a chat about that. So reach out to me at Shay at Rock Paper Scissors Biz and remember to mark your calendars and buy those super early bird badges for early bird badges for the Music Tectonics Conference happening November 4th through sixth in Santa Monica, California.
And that's a wrap. Thank you all.
Let us know what you think! Tweet @MusicTectonics, find us on LinkedIn, Facebook and Instagram, or connect with podcast host Dmitri Vietze on LinkedIn, Twitter, and Facebook.
The Music Tectonics podcast goes beneath the surface of the music industry to explore how technology is changing the way business gets done. Weekly episodes include interviews with music tech movers & shakers, deep dives into seismic shifts, and more.
